Do you find yourself paying off debt each month, only to find yourself surprised by an even higher credit card bill a month or two later? You might be in a debt cycle.
If you want to break the cycle of debt, it starts with understanding how money is moving in and out of your life. If you don’t think about your money until it starts to cause you pain, you end up spending and “figuring it out later”, often resorting to using your tax refund or holiday bonus to pay off debt. Discovering the habits keeping you in debt and then creating a plan to mindfully choose what you do — or don’t — want to use debt for, will help you break your debt cycle permanently.
In today’s episode, I’m talking about five things that might be keeping you in a debt cycle, how to pull yourself out of that cycle by examining your emotions and motivations, and the importance of setting boundaries and intentions around credit card usage so that you can finally move out of debt and into a more thoughtful, mature way of handling your finances.
When you understand the role that money plays in your life, when you have awareness of how you’re spending, and intention around how you want to spend, you can build long-term money habits that will help you stay out of debt. If you’re ready to commit to becoming a person who mindfully manages their finances, tune in to this episode!
In this episode, you’ll learn…
- [02:27] How making a commitment to yourself helps you break free from debt and build long-term skills for managing your money
- [12:14] How to break the debt cycle by examining your money habits
- [14:23] What you can do to address impulsive spending that’s tied to your emotions
- [17:51] Common reasons you’re in credit card debt and how to tackle them
- [25:09] How understanding the way you use debt allows you to make more thoughtful, long-term decisions
- [26:49] How setting intention and purpose for your credit card usage helps you stay out of debt
Tune in to this episode of Money Files for tips on breaking your debt cycle, gaining insight into your spending habits, and building solid money management habits.
Are you ready to start working toward your long-term financial goals? Apply to work with me, and let’s start working towards your financial goals.
How did you feel about this discussion on the debt cycle? Check out this episode that dives in the process of choosing your thoughts around your money.
Hi and welcome to Money Files. I’m Keina Newell from Wealth Over Now. I work every day with professional women and solopreneurs to help them get out of financial overwhelm and shame so they can experience more flexibility and ease with their finances. Are you ready to gain confidence and learn to manage your finances intentionally? Tune in and grab financial tips that will help you master the way you think about and manage your finances.
[00:00:32] Hello and welcome back to another episode of Money Files. If you’re on my email list, you’ve already heard this or if you follow me on social media, you’ve already heard this. But I want to share the story with you just in case you’re not in either one of those places or you were taking a social media break, whatever. Just know that I want to share this story with you because I think it’s so cool. And if you’re listening to me right now, I’m assuming that you are in one of a couple of different buckets. Maybe you currently work with me and you enjoy listening to me each week because there’s something that elevates the work that we’re doing together. Maybe we’ve previously worked together and you still enjoy hearing my voice and thinking about each week’s topic and how that applies to where you are financially. Or maybe you’ve just discovered me, or you’ve been listening to me for a while and you are seeking financial help.
[00:01:25] You know that you want to prioritize your finances, but you haven’t taken that next step. And that next step would be to apply to work with me. And I realize that where you are right now, you’re probably a very Type A person and you are very successful in every single area of your life. And you probably have some thoughts about what it would feel like to actually ask for help. So there’s some vulnerability there. There’s vulnerability in asking for help, like you could potentially make that mean something about yourself, which I totally understand because I myself have to work on asking for help. And then you have a lot of thoughts in terms of like shame. You’re like, okay, I could ask Keina for help, but I should be able to figure this out on my own. I should be able to do this.
[00:02:12] But I want to take you back to the fact that you probably made a decision at some point this year, this week, this month, that you actually want to get help with your finances, but you haven’t actually made that a priority in your life. And so I want to take you back to 2018 to what I think is a very transformative place in my own life and in the life of my first paid client.
[00:02:39] So in 2018, I want to say, was in September. I decided that I was going to host a budget workshop in person, and so I put it on Meetup like meetup.com. And I was promoting this workshop and several people signed up for the workshop. And when I sent out confirmations for the workshop, none of the people that told me they were coming actually confirmed that they were going to attend. So I had made plans like to print packets for the workshop, have breakfasts. Like I knew exactly where I needed to be on that Saturday. And so the thought crossed my mind to like not actually go through with the workshop since nobody confirmed that they were attending. But I went ahead and I got the breakfast sandwiches, I printed the packets, I got dressed, I showed up to where I was supposed to be. And in that same moment where I was showing up to where I was supposed to be, there were someone else who I didn’t know at the time who was showing up for themselves to prioritize their finances.
[00:03:42] And so my first client, Amanda, she ended up signing up for that workshop that morning and we had some kind of correspondence where I told her where to meet me and we were at a we work building, but it was just me and her in this room, a lot of breakfast sandwiches, me and her. But because she kept her commitment and I kept my commitment. So my commitment was to do the workshop and her commitment was to prioritize her finances. We met, so like I was showing up for her and she was showing up for herself and we worked 1 to 1 together in that little we work office. And then a couple of weeks later I was hosting like a continuation of the workshop that I was continuing or continuing to promote. And she came to that workshop as well.
[00:04:29] And then we ended up working together for almost I want to say it was a good like nine months, 9 to 10 months that we ended up working together. And last week she responded to an email that I had sent out to my general list, and she said, Keina, I just want you to know that I still use the budgeting tool that you supported me with. And I like that tool has just been transformational in my life. I’m also thinking about where I want to go in my career next, and I had a number in my head. I ended up getting an even better offer from another company. And so I’m going to like move forward with this other job offer, which means that I’m going to be paying down my student loans sooner than I expected.
[00:05:09] But I couldn’t help but think because she followed through on that commitment to herself, like the result that she’s created for herself almost four years later. And it’s because she decided to go ahead and take the next step and prioritize her financial health. And because she’s prioritized her financial health. She’s paid off $20,000 in student loan debt. She has a fully funded emergency fund. But she’s continued to see the return on investment of that one decision that was going to create. I mean, immediate the immediate result she wanted was to have a budget. She wanted to know where her money was going and feel in control. And she wanted to, like, participate in all activities. That’s one of the things I remember about our coaching is that she’s like, know, I love to like do these festive activities that I want to have money in my budget to do these things. And I enjoy traveling.
[00:06:04] But she’s been able to do the things that she enjoys as well as do other things that she never thought was going to be possible for herself, especially when we started at the time that we did. And Amanda is someone who she was in a lot of credit card debt. She had done like the balance transfers, which I’m sure a lot of you are accustomed to. She’d done the balance transfers, but still had accumulated more debt because she didn’t really fix the root cause of why she was in debt. But because of our work together, she’s been able to address that root cause. She’s been able to pay down the debt. She continues to go in her plan and make intentional decisions so that her money is in alignment with how she desires to live life.
[00:06:47] So if you’ve wondered, like, okay, Keina, I’m going to work with you for five months, but then what? Like, this is the then what? Amanda and I worked together over four years ago, and one of the reasons I share her story with you is because I do want you to know what’s possible. Like when you work with me, this is going to be the last investment you have to make to try to figure out how do I want to manage my finances? We’re going to get that figured out together. And after we figure out your budget, which happens in the very first month of us coaching together, we’re going to get to address the other things that come up for you financially, whether it’s the hiccup of planning for Christmas or you’re looking to get married because you’re recently engaged, or you want to buy a house and you want to know what those expenses look like, like we’re going to be able to go through those things together.
[00:07:35] So when you hear me, whether I’m on social media in an email on this podcast, tell you like, don’t wait for the perfect time. The perfect time is now. It really is because we’re going to be able to do that work in tandem with one another. You’re going to have the support, you’re going to have the accountability. And the only step that you need to take to move forward is to say, yes, I’m going to prioritize myself. Yes, I want that transformation and I want it right now. Don’t delay it because who knows where you can be a month from now, two months from now, six months from now, like Amanda, four years from now, like being able to understand where your money is going, knowing your numbers, whether you are a solopreneur or you’re thinking about transitioning into business, or you’re just managing your 9 to 5 income when you understand where your numbers are going.
[00:08:26] Everything else around you is going to change. You’re going to become the person that’s confident with your finances, which will show up in every single area of your life. And that’s not something you want to delay. That’s urgent, because every second that you’re trying to figure it out and piecemeal it together, you’re not getting the results that you truly desire. So go to www.wealthovernow.com/appointment and apply to work with me make the commitment that like you know what we got a few months left in this year and I desire to move forward. I want to follow through on that commitment that I talked about earlier this year where I said I wanted to prioritize my finances and the doors are open for you to work with me. I’m going to work with 15 more people. I’m committed to working with 15 more people this year, and I would love for you to be one of them.
[00:09:14] So the other reason I told you about Amanda and I was telling you about the debt piece is because she paid off $20,000 worth of credit card debt. And a lot of the clients that come to me have this relationship with debt where they’re like in and out of credit card debt. If you listen to Janine’s episode, we talk about being in and out of credit card debt. People are trying to answer the question of like, how do I get out of credit card debt and not get back in credit card debt? So I’m sure you can relate to it being tax season, right? And you get a big refund. So you’re excited that you’re getting a big refund because you can finally pay off your credit card balance. So you take your refund, you pay off your credit card balance. Then you fast forward a couple of months and you realize that your credit card debt has started to creep back up again. And now you’re planning on like using your end of year bonus to pay off your credit card debt.
[00:10:09] So if you’re being honest with yourself, like you’ve probably gone through this cycle numerous times, but you find yourself in the same situation. So you’ve taken your credit card debt down to zero, but then it just slowly creeps back up again and you find yourself with $500 balance and 1500 dollar balance. Now it’s a $3,000 balance. Now it’s a $5,000 balance. And quite frankly, it’s just overwhelming because you feel like you’re like Groundhog Day. You’re just always back in the situation. So when you get a bonus, you don’t get to do anything with it. Besides pay down credit card debt. When you get extra income or unexpected money, it goes to credit card debt. The tax refund. If you get a tax refund, it goes to credit card debt. Like this is just the existence that you have. And people often ask like, should I pay off debt or should I save? And a few episodes ago I talked about like how to build your emergency fund and how to address different options for paying down your debt. But those things don’t matter if you don’t actually know and you haven’t investigated your relationship with money. Right. So paying off debt or saving or do I take the lump sum of money in my savings account and pay off my debt? Like I would venture to say that you’ve probably done those things before.
[00:11:28] And the reason that you’re that they’re not working is because because it comes down to the decision making process you use when you should or should not purchase something. So you probably find yourself in a space where you find yourself saying like, Oh, I’ll figure it out later. Or, I don’t know how the balance got this high. And it’s because like you’re not aware of how money moves in your life and it moves out of your life. So in terms of like you spending your money and so until you actually address what’s putting you into debt, then you’re going to be in and out of the debt cycle, in and out of the debt cycle, because money isn’t something that you actually pay attention to until it causes you pain.
[00:12:15] So let’s talk about how you can get out of the debt cycle. So the first thing I want you to do is I want you to identify what’s putting you into debt. So maybe it’s impulsive spending that’s like tied to your emotions, right? You find yourself in Target, TJ, Max Marshall’s and you find yourself when you’re in those places, you know, you’re creeping down aisles because maybe you’ve had a bad day or you just wanted to go there to like release whatever that looks like. And so now when you’re at Target, instead of going in for the three things that were on your list, you come out with a $200 receipt or you go to Marshalls just because it may be a habit and you want to get out of the house. You go into Marshalls and you come out with $100 worth of candles. You haven’t planned for these candles. You just end up coming out of Marshalls with $100 worth of candles. And here’s the thing. The $200 receipt at Target, the $100 candle purchased at Marshall’s as an isolated expense. Those things aren’t necessarily good or bad, but because you have this habit of impulsive spending and it’s probably tied to your emotions, it’s ending up putting you further and further into debt.
[00:13:31] The same thing could be true like at the grocery store, right? Like you go in and I know I’m saying this from personal experience because I feel like grocery money. Is it real money, right? Like you have to eat. And so because you have to eat, you could end up at the grocery store spending a lot more money than you actually intended. You don’t even know how much you intended to spend, but maybe you find yourself at the grocery store 2 to 3 days a week, and those grocery trips are like $100 each. But then you also find yourself on Uber Eats because all the groceries in your refrigerator, none of it seems like something you actually want to eat. And so just by like having these kind of like impulsive habits and not being aware of how you spend money or when you spend money, now your food budget for one week could be $500 just because you don’t take the time to actually think about what you’re doing. You’re doing things that are a little bit more mindless. So if you have what I would call like impulsive spending, especially, that’s tied to your emotions, I think you can do two things to address that. One, you can institute a 24 hour rule, right? I think this is great for anything that comes off line or even thinking about like Target, you don’t have to buy the things in the dollar bin or the random shirt you saw at the end of the aisle.
[00:14:47] So instituting a 24 hour rule, give yourself 24 hours and decide like, do I actually want that thing? Like, why do I want the thing that I put into my cart? Am I going to use it? Or is that just a moment where right now I can identify that I’m being a little bit impulsive? And it just sounded like a good thing at the time. I have so many things in my Amazon, like I don’t even know if it’s a wish list, but you know, you like save for later. There are so many things there that I’m like, Oh my goodness, that was so impulsive in that moment. I thought I needed it and it’s so easy to get those things to come to your house. So institute that 24 hour rule. I would also say the other thing, especially when you’re in brick and mortar stores like Target. You’re going to Marshall’s a grocery store. Like, you do need to go to those places. Right. But a great tip is to make a list and follow it. So if you’re going to the grocery store and let’s say it’s a monday, and if you’re a fickle eater like me, I probably can’t buy food for the whole week because by the time Friday comes, I want something different.
[00:15:51] So maybe it’s Monday. You’ve decided, okay, I’m going to the store Monday, try to make plans at least through Wednesday. Like, what are your meals going to be? What do you want to eat for lunch? What do you want to eat for dinner? Do you have any events that you’re going to being able to kind of process? Like where and how you’re going to be spending your time or maybe, you know, on Wednesday nights you always like to treat yourself to something, right? So you don’t actually need to buy groceries for Wednesday night dinner. But think about what you actually want at the grocery store. Take stock of what you already have in your house and make your list accordingly. Like that’s going to help you spend less money at the grocery store. And I know a lot of people, like, just swipe their credit card for things like grocery store items. Once again, not good or bad. But if you don’t if you’re not mindful of how money is moving in your life, then groceries can be something that’s causing you to go into debt.
[00:16:44] And you know, who wants to know that they are paying 20% interest on their grocery bill just because of the fact that like you didn’t actually consider how much you spend on groceries from week to week. And so I put that in the impulsive spending category because I think we get to the grocery store, we maybe have a mental list, but then we see all the amazing things on sale and we don’t actually take into account what we came into the store for and how we’re going to actually follow that. So if you are an impulsive spender and you know that that’s tied to your emotions, like I said, institute a 24 hour rule and then make a list and follow it. You can make a list for Target, make a list for Marshalls. You can make a list for groceries. Another great idea here, too, in terms of making a list is like you can also keep a running list in your phone. Or sometimes I like to put a post-it when I know that I run out of something because inevitably so you run out of garlic and you go to the store just for garlic. You’re going to come home with more than just garlic.
[00:17:41] So if you keep that ongoing list of things that you need to replenish, that can just help you be more mindful of how you’re spending money. So you’re not spending on things that you actually haven’t planned for. So another reason that you may be in debt is that you’re missing the mark on paying off your credit card in full each month. So I see this all the time where people tell me like Keina I’m using my credit card because I want to get points and I use this credit card because it’s really good for this and I’m able to pay off my balance each month. But then there becomes a time where they can’t pay their balance off each month because honestly, guys, you could have the money in your account to pay your credit card off each month. But if that money was supposed to be used for something else, then you’re just you’re just battling yourself there.
[00:18:27] So if you notice that your balance is higher than you can actually afford to pay, and when I mean afford, I mean that you can actually do the other things that you want to do, like pay off your bills, save money. Like those are the, the other things that I’m considering the remedy I need you to consider and not even consider. But the remedy I need you to take is to create a budget or a spending plan. You can grab my template and actually look at like, what are the things that I’m putting on my credit card if I’m thinking about a balance that I can pay off each month, what is that balance? Right. So actually having guardrails for yourself, not just letting like sometimes you pay off $1,000, sometimes you can pay off $3,000. But really thinking about what is that amount that you want to pay off each month with my clients, if they want to pay off credit cards or want to use credit cards for their day to day spending, we get really clear on like, well, how much spending money do you have each week and how much spending money do you have each month?
[00:19:29] So that when we’re looking at those credit card balances, we’re looking at credit card transactions, we aren’t just going in with like, oh, my bank account balance is 1500 dollars and my credit card is 1200 dollars. So I can pay that off. I try to teach them to be like methodical about it and actually have a number that’s defined so they know like am I actually within my budget in terms of my spending? Another reason that you may be in debt is that you have this ongoing narrative in your head that you’ll just figure it out later. So you suffer from I’ll figure it out later, thinking, so when you are in this like frame of mind, you will charge something on your credit card and you don’t actually have a plan. You just say like, I’ll figure it out later, right? So it’s just go, go, go, go, go. So you have a lot of expenses on your credit card that just ah, I’ll figure it out later. Expenses and if you are remitting figuring it out later thinking I need you to get clear on like what are you figuring out. How can you incorporate those things into your plan?
[00:20:33] Because you can’t just figure everything out. Right. And it probably is a little bit related to like this impulsive spending with a trip with a friend that you want to take. And so you’re like, Oh, I’ll just figure it out later when the shift that I want you to make, if you have a budget, is to think about like, how am I planning in trips into my year? Right? I don’t just want to have to figure that out later. If you have a dog that needs boarding, you shouldn’t just be figuring that out later. Maybe your dog has a as a vet expense. You don’t have to figure those things out later. You own a dog, you have friends. You can plan trips, you can plan that visits. You can plan these, figure it out later things into your budget over time. So then that way, when you think about things that are putting you into debt, we’re eliminating the things that you just have to figure out later. And then the other thing that may be putting you into debt is maybe you do have some true emergencies, right?
[00:21:29] Maybe you had a loss of a job or you have a car repair. And so I don’t want you to sit there and beat yourself up for, you know, real reasons that you needed to use your credit card. But I do want you to consider that you can set some goals around having money for future needs. So if you had a car repair, maybe you needed tires and you didn’t have $600 for your tires to be replaced and a $600 is on your credit card. I want you to consider how can I create an auto maintenance fund? So the next time this happens, I have some money sitting aside that I can put towards my car repairs, right? If you experience loss of a job and you had to put some expenses on your credit card, I want you to think about like right now in my current situation, how am I saving money to build an emergency fund? So for a rainy day, I know that I have money in account if I lose my job.
[00:22:23] So it’s it’s about thinking about what are your proactive moves that you’re taking moving forward. Because just because you you’re in a situation where you’re able to pay down your credit card if you haven’t actually planned for the loss of a job or you haven’t planned for the car repairs, you’re going to end up right back into the same situation. And so that’s where we’re thinking about like, how do I get out of the debt cycle? Because I recognize that I’ve been in and out of the debt cycle. And then the last thing that I would say in terms of what’s putting you into debt is that you may not be accounting for infrequent or lifestyle expenses. And I feel like some of these things have their own kind of bucket. So maybe you plan for the trip, but you didn’t plan that you would want to get your nails done and your hair done. So you just put that on a credit card or you didn’t plan for the fact that your property taxes are due it. Instead of being able to pay them, you had to put them on a credit card or you forgot about some other annual expense. Right?
[00:23:25] So just when I’m thinking about what’s on your credit card, when you’re thinking about what’s on your credit card, think about what’s infrequent or like these lifestyle expenses, maybe it’s a flight, any of these things. And really think about how do I capture how I can be prepared for this thing the next time. So I want you to always be thinking about we’re thinking about moving forward. If you make sure that like if we’re talking about trips, don’t just think about the plane ticket, think about the other habits that you have that come around trip time. And if you can think about those other habits, then you know how much money you should be saving to make sure that you’re going to have enough for the next trip that you desire to go on. Or, you know, maybe you had weddings or baby showers to attend this year and that was new. So think about moving forward. Are your friends in a lifestyle or season where you’re going to need to go to baby showers and you’re going to need to go to weddings? Or maybe people are getting ready to have 30th or 40th birthday parties. So think about how those things may have impacted your spending and then expenses that ended up on your credit card.
[00:24:31] I just talked through five things that may be putting you into debt. Right. But remember, we’re talking about getting out of the debt cycle. So what I also want you to consider is knowing right now I’m working on paying off my debt or maybe you’re newly out of debt. And the thing that I want you to now do is also to set healthy financial boundaries with yourself. It may be true that you have to use your credit card at some point for something that you didn’t plan for. So what I don’t want you to hear is that I’m like, don’t ever use your credit card, right? Like, maybe you do have to use your credit card for something that you haven’t planned for. But before that time comes, I want you to set healthy boundaries with yourself.
[00:25:16] I want you to ask yourself, like, what am I willing to go into debt for? Like, are you willing to go into debt for overpriced groceries at Whole Foods? Are you willing to go into debt for dental surgery? Are you willing to go into debt for a plane ticket? But think about like, what am I willing to go into debt for? So if you know, I’m going to put this on my credit card and I’m not going to be able to pay it off at the end of the month. Like, what are those things that you’re willing to go into debt for? Then I want you to answer If I go into debt, how soon will I pay it off? So maybe you recognize I need to put a $400 plane ticket on my credit card. I can’t afford to pay that all off this month, but I can afford to put $100 a month for the next four and a half months, five months towards my credit card. And I’m going to pay this plane ticket off in the next five months. I realize that I’m not going to pay $400. I’m going to pay $420 because of interest or whatever that looks like. Right.
[00:26:19] But you have a plan for what you’re able to go into debt for, what you’re willing to go into debt for, and then you have a plan for being able to pay it off. So that really isn’t the same as going in and out of the debt cycle. I think that’s a healthy use of debt. And then you actually have your spending, planning, your budget that’s going to allow you to account for how you’re going to pay that off over the next 3 to 4 months. Or the next six months, whatever that looks like.
[00:26:50] The next thing I want you to consider as well is set an intention and purpose for your credit cards. Some of my clients might have like five credit cards, and they’ve gotten the credit cards for different reasons, but they don’t really have a purpose for any of the credit cards. It’s just like I spend on the credit card that’s in my car, in my wallet, or the one that’s attached virtually to the account that I’m spending from. So when your credit cards are kind of all spread out, that’s how you have a balance on one that maybe you didn’t know about and you just end up kind of creating this confusion for yourself. So I would really suggest that you set an intention and purpose for your credit cards. Maybe you have a credit card that’s at a credit union and it’s really low interest rate. So you know that that’s your go to credit card, right? You’re not worried about earning points. You’re more so worried about managing your money well. And by being focused on that, you know that that’s the only credit card I use. I might have some other cards, but I’m not using them. I’m not necessarily closing them down, but I’m just going to put them away so that I’m focused on using one credit card really well. And so that can just help you be really aware of where your money is going and help you see all of your money in one place if you are someone who uses credit cards.
[00:28:03] The next thing that I would suggest is that you unlink your credit cards. So if you have Apple Pay like that, right, there could be something that maybe doesn’t serve you very well. So just consider this Apple Pay, Serve Me or any of the other pay mobile pay apps that they have. Because if you are just using your phone to pay for things, you may not actually be paying attention to what’s happening with your money. And so once again, when you get to the end of the month, you’re like, Oh, wow, I didn’t realize I spent that much money because you haven’t looked at your credit card statement, you’re using your phone to swipe. And so it just it tends to accommodate for impulsive spending when you have your cards linked to a lot of different things. So maybe you want to unlink your card on Apple, pay Amazon or on PayPal. Because I think that when you have to get up and physically get the card, sometimes you’re deterred from actually wanting to spend the money because we’re naturally too lazy to get up and get the card right. So think about that because that might help you just naturally shift how you’re spending money and help you really get out of this debt cycle because of the fact that you’re not going to be spending money on things that were once just convenient and going in with a monkey on your credit cards, like leave your cards at home.
[00:29:18] If you know that you only want to use one card, take the other cards out, put them in your sock drawer. Like make those things that just aren’t tempting to you so that you aren’t using your credit cards and racking up balances that you’re not actually paying attention to. So I hope this episode was helpful in thinking about how you want to get out of the debt cycle. I know a lot of you can relate to your tax refund or lump sum of money going towards your credit card, but if you just take some time to think about why am I in debt? What do I want my boundaries to be around using my credit card? This can help shift everything for you. And by shifting the way that you think about and manage money, the next time that you pay down or you pay off your credit card, it can be the last time that you have to be in that situation. Or if you have to hold a balance, you’ll have a plan for knowing exactly how you are going to pay that credit card off. And it doesn’t have to be something that feels really heavy and overwhelming and cause anxiety in your life. So thank you for tuning into this episode. If you found this episode helpful or you found anything in any one of my podcasts helpful, I would love for you to leave a review or you can tag me if you’re listening to it in your Instagram stories. I would love to hear your thoughts, so have a great week. Bye. Thank you so much for listening to Money Files. If you’re ready to take the next step to reach your financial goals, head to www.wealthovernow.com/appointment and let’s get started.